I'm just going ot leave this here.

by **Leiningen** Thu Sep 04, 2014 2:55 am

http://theconversation.com/99-999-certainty-humans-are-driving-global-warming-new-study-29911

Read it, if you can come up with a counter that's more than, hurr durr this is dumb and link a stupid moncton video I'd love to read it.

by **blackhorizon** Thu Sep 04, 2014 4:55 am

There are periods in earths history when we had 3%,10% even 50% more c02 in the atmosphere, if c02 has a effect on the climate then we should see in in the temperature reconstruction, the ice core samples say that c02 does not drive climate change. its more likely its solar based since the sun and our large amount of water is the largest % of all green house gasses(evaporated water). Volcanoes is another source of green house gases.

Yes CO2 and temp are related. BUT is is increasing temps that CAUSE more CO2 to be released in to the atmosphere not the other way around. Solar activity increases then the earth warms then the oceans produce more CO2 AND more plants grow and die and create more CO2 and more animals thrive and produce more CO2. Humans are responsible for less than 1% of atmospheric CO2 , Volcanos, animals dying, plants decaying, living animals and plants together don't come close to the amount of CO2 produced by the oceans. The Sun causes global warming thru a normal billions year old process.

I believe in in climate change but its always changing its been hotter then it is now and cooler and it seems to go back and fourth.

Sun is getting older, solar storms and what ever else the sun is doing to increase temp on the planet. the more water that is evaporated the more green house gasses are in the atmosphere. Nasa's big secret is that all planets are on a warming trend.

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/02/070228-mars-warming.html
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread221608/pg1

by **blackhorizon** Thu Sep 04, 2014 5:06 am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BB0aFPXr4n4

this is all u need

by **Leiningen** Thu Sep 04, 2014 12:20 pm

I'm not worried about global warming. I also love Carlin and have seen that many times before. I just wanted to leave this because of a chat, sometimes the shit I hear needs a response.

We can measure the sun's effect on the earth, we have diverged from that graph starting in about 1970.

We've gotten to a point where there is measurable, demonstrable facts this is happening and we did it. 99% of scientists in a field related to global climate are in agreement it is happening (the number for people who believe the world is flat is about the same).

I'm not running around hugging tree's and trying to save the world. I'm a bit upset that my country is still sitting on the fence and not trying to make money developing and advancing sciences related to this. No one is going to stop burning fossil fuels anytime soon and so be it.

by **Leiningen** Thu Sep 04, 2014 12:29 pm

blackhorizon wrote:http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2007/02/070228-mars-warming.html
http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread221608/pg1

1st article February 28, 2007
2nd artticle posted on Aug, 16 2006 @ 03:58 AM

those are old and were refuted before even being posted http://www.realclimate.org/index.php/archives/2005/10/global-warming-on-mars/. There is much more on the "mars is warming" and how it's not true. To sum it up, the proof of mars warming is from 2 pictures from 2 specific dates and an incorrect guess (not a scientific guess either).

by **quicktrigger81** Thu Sep 04, 2014 8:36 pm

does anybody care about this crap? the world could blow up tomorrow because all the Penguins take a crap at the same time... Until we get China to stop pumping out Co2 at an alarming rate we're just pissing in the wind. I say light one up and throw a middle finger towards the Polar ice caps.

by **blackhorizon** Thu Sep 04, 2014 11:17 pm

what i know as a fact from geological and ice core data that C02 has never drove the warming , matter a fact its a product of warming. this is what the ice core data tells us that c02 doesnt drive climate change, well it certainly never has in the past. also scientist that try to get funding to disprove of man made global warning do not get funded, if u dont believe in this agenda u are label a heretic and this is not the scientific way.

ya those articles are older but true its why u can look thru a normal telescope and see clouds on mars i do this regulary. CLOUDS on Mars!! the sun is 99% of the mass of the solar system and is the largest effect on global warming. do i believe in man made GW well im not 100% sure on anything, i do believe we pollute extremly and need to control it. We as humans are so minuute in the bigger picture.

There is nothing that can replace petroleum, its in everything. Petroleum base products are everywhere.. science will not come up with 1 or 10 things that will replace petroleum

http://whgbetc.com/petro-products.pdf

by **Leiningen** Thu Sep 04, 2014 11:57 pm

quicktrigger81 wrote:does anybody care about this crap? the world could blow up tomorrow because all the Penguins take a crap at the same time... Until we get China to stop pumping out Co2 at an alarming rate we're just pissing in the wind. I say light one up and throw a middle finger towards the Polar ice caps.

"if you can come up with a counter that's more than, hurr durr this is dumb"

I find it and other ideas interesting and like other people's opinions even if (actually just because) they are different than mine. It's called challenging your world view, I would highly recommend it.

by **Leiningen** Fri Sep 05, 2014 12:06 am

blackhorizon wrote:what i know as a fact from geological and ice core data that C02 has never drove the warming , matter a fact its a product of warming. this is what the ice core data tells us that c02 doesnt drive climate change, well it certainly never has in the past. also scientist that try to get funding to disprove of man made global warning do not get funded, if u dont believe in this agenda u are label a heretic and this is not the scientific way.

ya those articles are older but true its why u can look thru a normal telescope and see clouds on mars i do this regulary. CLOUDS on Mars!! the sun is 99% of the mass of the solar system and is the largest effect on global warming. do i believe in man made GW well im not 100% sure on anything, i do believe we pollute extremly and need to control it. We as humans are so minuute in the bigger picture.

There is nothing that can replace petroleum, its in everything. Petroleum base products are everywhere.. science will not come up with 1 or 10 things that will replace petroleum

http://whgbetc.com/petro-products.pdf

Yep, petroleum is the single most useful and used chemical known to man. Why would you want to burn that?

We absolutely can't predict or measure weather on mars, we have barely been able to do it on earth. I wasn't kidding though, that prediction was on 2 pictures, because the second was brighter that equaled more snow and ice therefore colder. It's an impossible statement to make. Also we can measure the distance from the sun and see how active it is. We are in a particularly low period of activity and in the point of orbit that is furthest from the sun. Yes CO2 is generated by the heating of the planet but it is also the cause of more heating, this process snowballs, we also see that. So it was natural at some point for that to happen, what's unnatural is humans adding a crapton of CO2 to the mix and getting it started.

by **blackhorizon** Fri Sep 05, 2014 1:33 am

Leiningen wrote:
blackhorizon wrote:what i know as a fact from geological and ice core data that C02 has never drove the warming , matter a fact its a product of warming. this is what the ice core data tells us that c02 doesnt drive climate change, well it certainly never has in the past. also scientist that try to get funding to disprove of man made global warning do not get funded, if u dont believe in this agenda u are label a heretic and this is not the scientific way.

ya those articles are older but true its why u can look thru a normal telescope and see clouds on mars i do this regulary. CLOUDS on Mars!! the sun is 99% of the mass of the solar system and is the largest effect on global warming. do i believe in man made GW well im not 100% sure on anything, i do believe we pollute extremly and need to control it. We as humans are so minuute in the bigger picture.

There is nothing that can replace petroleum, its in everything. Petroleum base products are everywhere.. science will not come up with 1 or 10 things that will replace petroleum

http://whgbetc.com/petro-products.pdf

Yep, petroleum is the single most useful and used chemical known to man. Why would you want to burn that?

We absolutely can't predict or measure weather on mars, we have barely been able to do it on earth. I wasn't kidding though, that prediction was on 2 pictures, because the second was brighter that equaled more snow and ice therefore colder. It's an impossible statement to make. Also we can measure the distance from the sun and see how active it is. We are in a particularly low period of activity and in the point of orbit that is furthest from the sun. Yes CO2 is generated by the heating of the planet but it is also the cause of more heating, this process snowballs, we also see that. So it was natural at some point for that to happen, what's unnatural is humans adding a crapton of CO2 to the mix and getting it started.

what happened the last time c02 was 10% higher then it is now, or even 50% higher our planet was this lush and green, our atmosphere was thicker larger reached further into space, the tree's, bugs, animals where all larger this is a by product of more c02. do u think our planet is gonna run out of control and become Venus. the planet has defenses for this. it only takes 1 disaster to plummet earth into a ice age, it doesnt take much. for instance if the ice caps melt to fast , which they are doing, the gulf stream will shut down causing a ice age in the northern hemisphere. so the planet heats to fast it currents will shut down from to much fresh water. this is just one of many way the earth can regulate it temp. Us Humans, our stay on this planet is limited 99.9% of all species have been extincted. we dont even know if we have been the smartest or most intelligent species to be created. The earth will regulate itself, with that said i agree changes need to be made. im just not ever gonna say that man made c02 is why global warming is happening, is it helping it along maybe, could it be other things maybe. i will continue to study all aspect of this like i always have. every piece of evidence deserves a review even if i think its absurd, it is the scientific way.

here is a link i have read some and havent had the time to rebuke anything as of yet but it the other side and deserve the same amount of attention.

http://www.climatechangedispatch.com/the-myth-of-a-global-warming-consensus.html

In the Ordovician period of the Paleozoic era (about 450 million years ago), the Earth had an atmospheric CO
2concentration estimated at 4400ppm (or 0.44% of the atmosphere), while also having evidence of some glaciation. Modeling work has shown that it is possible for local areas at elevations greater than 300–500 meters to contain year-round snow cover even with high atmospheric CO
2 concentrations.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Climate_change#Ocean_variability
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_variation

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmic_ray

by **Leiningen** Fri Sep 05, 2014 3:44 am

This explains the higher CO2 better than I can http://www.skepticalscience.com/print.php?r=77

also I would really look up the funding for sites before linking them. This might sound funny since I basically said the same thing in a different thread. That site you linked in funded by the Koch brothers. There aren't many people who would deny global warming if not for the money. There aren't many people who would pay someone to spread that information. It's not some crazy conspiracy, Koch brothers have good reasons to do what they do but I won't trust them.

Just google "who funds climate change denial"

by **quicktrigger81** Fri Sep 05, 2014 8:51 am

I like my hurr durr answer and really besides lenni who gives a fuck

ok so that was my knee jerk reaction...

We as indiviuals have no control over the Climate Change, Global Warming or whatever the left wing nut jobs call it today. Even "we" as nations can't change things if 10 or so of the NATO nations won't do anything to change it. America, Australia, England and France can NOT make a difference when nations like Chania and Japan dispence more Co2 than most other countries combined.

In closing, We are insignificant in the grand scheme of things. In the 80 or so years we have on this Planet what we do doesn't matter. The Earth survived before us it will survive during us and it will survive after us.

Yours Truly,

Billy

by **SilkySmooth** Fri Sep 05, 2014 9:40 am

In 2007 I was working in Adak Alaska. A island far out in the Aleutian chain once owned by the Navy with a nice deep water port and piers.

I do not remember the company - but they were doing a fact finding study looking for a port that they could use for when the polar ice melted enough. They already had studies of how the ice would melt and believed that it would open shipping lanes that could be used to move cargo from one side of the world to the other though these lanes.

I was really in disbelief - I mean if the ice melts that much where we would have shipping lanes over the polar cap wouldn't we have other and bigger problems to worry about?

My point is that not only do we know it will happen - we are planning on it. We will adapt and carry on.

by **Triskaideka** Sat Sep 06, 2014 12:18 am

Honestly... Climate Change is going to happen. It is not terribly worrisome. The earth has been a LOT warmer before.

http://www.nap.edu/openbook.php?record_id=12168&page=19

The thing is, if the earth gets warmer, it will likely get wetter. And wetter means more vegetation. Wetter can also increase the habitable places on the planet.

http://www.livescience.com/4180-sahara-desert-lush-populated.html

People love to doomsay. They love to fear change. Change isn't always bad or terrible. Change is change. If you learn to adapt, you will thrive.

by **blackhorizon** Sat Sep 06, 2014 3:12 am

my point is im not denying anything there are just many ways climate change happens, humans are not the #1 cause, if climate change never happened then oxygen bearing life would have never occurred, just like that algae did billions of yrs ago, made our planet more friendly to different species.

causes of green house gasses

#1 Solar/galactic influences
#2 plant life and organism decay
#3 tech tonic, volcanic

story of climate change to this point in our atmosphere

Earth’s original atmosphere was probably just hydrogen and helium, because these were the main gases in the dusty, gassy disk around the Sun from which the planets formed. The Earth and its atmosphere were very hot. Molecules of hydrogen and helium move really fast, especially when warm. Actually, they moved so fast they eventually all escaped Earth's gravity and drifted off into space.

Earth’s “second atmosphere” came from Earth itself. There were lots of volcanoes, many more than today, because Earth’s crust was still forming. The volcanoes released.
steam (H2O, with two hydrogen atoms and one oxygen atom)
carbon dioxide(CO2, with one carbon atoms and two oxygen atoms),
ammonia (NH3, with one nitrogen atom and three hydrogen atoms)

Much of the CO2 dissolved into the oceans. Eventually, a simple form of bacteria developed that could live on energy from the Sun and carbon dioxide in the water, producing oxygen as a waste product. Thus, oxygen began to build up in the atmosphere, while the carbon dioxide levels continued to drop. Meanwhile, the ammonia molecules in the atmosphere were broken apart by sunlight, leaving nitrogen and hydrogen. The hydrogen, being the lightest element, rose to the top of the atmosphere and much of it eventually drifted off into space.

So plants and some bacteria use carbon dioxide and give off oxygen, and animals use oxygen and give off carbon-dioxide—how convenient! The atmosphere upon which life depends was created by life itself.

C02 only makes up .0385% of our atmosphere make up

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